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sonnylax
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 Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:34 Post subject:
| AlaninTX wrote: | | A gap has developed between global oil production and discovery. |
Many people would argue this is due in large part to the environmentalists. We haven't built a new oil refinery in this country in over 25 years. We can't drill in many areas for new potential oil sources (i.e. Alaskan refuge).
I fully realize that oil is finite energy resource on this planet, but how can we discover/produce more oil with these pretty severe limitations.
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elkid
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:38 Post subject:
| sonnylax wrote: | Many people would argue this is due in large part to the environmentalists. We haven't built a new oil refinery in this country in over 25 years. We can't drill in many areas for new potential oil sources (i.e. Alaskan refuge).
I fully realize that oil is finite energy resource on this planet, but how can we discover/produce more oil with these pretty severe limitations. |
If protecting natural wildlife and land instead of digging everything up until there's nothing left but waste is a "severe limitation", so be it. I am not a huge fan of nature per se, but it would be horrible to live upon a barren wasteland. We should be seeking more creative methods for fuel than simply draining our planet dry of everything, particularly the finite resources. Someone needs to start funding infinite resource exploitation, like wind.
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jrjo
Gone Fishin
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:40 Post subject:
| megawill wrote: | so I agree with your statement, that we need to 'get out of OPEC's pocket'...but I'll ask who do you think is more likely to lead us down that road, our current oil baron President or the Democratic alternative who has been pushing for this for years?...  |
If energy policy ranked higher than other issues for me personally, then you're right, Kerry is a better candidate, but I have 'trump' issues that determine my vote.
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sonnylax
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:40 Post subject:
| elkid wrote: |
If protecting natural wildlife and land instead of digging everything up until there's nothing left but waste is a "severe limitation", so be it. I am not a huge fan of nature per se, but it would be horrible to live upon a barren wasteland. We should be seeking more creative methods for fuel than simply draining our planet dry of everything, particularly the finite resources. Someone needs to start funding infinite resource exploitation, like wind. |
Bush proposed drilling in less then 5% of the Alaskan refuge. The environmental lobby acted like he wanted to pave over the Grand Canyon.
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Pug
The Movie Geek
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:42 Post subject:
| sonnylax wrote: |
Bush proposed drilling in less then 5% of the Alaskan refuge. The environmental lobby acted like he wanted to pave over the Grand Canyon. |
You give them a foot, they'll take a mile. That's probably the concern of the e-lobby. Once you let drilling in, you'll never get them out, so why would you permit them to start?
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sonnylax
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:44 Post subject:
| jrjo wrote: |
If energy policy ranked higher than other issues for me personally, then you're right, Kerry is a better candidate, but I have 'trump' issues that determine my vote. |
I agree completely jrjo. Ditto for me on the gay marriage thing or the potential selection of supreme court justice (litmus test, no litmus test on abortion).
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cherylpf
crazy cat lady
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:45 Post subject:
| sonnylax wrote: |
Bush proposed drilling in less then 5% of the Alaskan refuge. The environmental lobby acted like he wanted to pave over the Grand Canyon. |
But that buys a few more minutes in the scheme of things to find alternatives right? The environmental lobby is not the problem here, its the fact that we are so dependent as a nation on a finite resource.
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elkid
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:46 Post subject:
| Pug wrote: | | You give them a foot, they'll take a mile. That's probably the concern of the e-lobby. Once you let drilling in, you'll never get them out, so why would you permit them to start? |
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sonnylax
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:46 Post subject:
| Pug wrote: | | You give them a foot, they'll take a mile. That's probably the concern of the e-lobby. Once you let drilling in, you'll never get them out, so why would you permit them to start? |
Maybe, maybe not. You can set limitations on their work.
Whether you agree or not, our economy (top to bottom) will take a severe hit once oil dries up. You think we saw horrible inflation and unemployment rates during the Jimmy Carter years... wait till that happens.
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Pug
The Movie Geek
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:46 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: |
But that buys a few more minutes in the scheme of things to find alternatives right? The environmental lobby is not the problem here, its the fact that we are so dependent as a nation on a finite resource. |
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phillycat
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:50 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: |
But that buys a few more minutes in the scheme of things to find alternatives right? The environmental lobby is not the problem here, its the fact that we are so dependent as a nation on a finite resource. |
Exactly!!
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AlaninTX
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:53 Post subject:
| sonnylax wrote: |
Many people would argue this is due in large part to the environmentalists. We haven't built a new oil refinery in this country in over 25 years. We can't drill in many areas for new potential oil sources (i.e. Alaskan refuge).
I fully realize that oil is finite energy resource on this planet, but how can we discover/produce more oil with these pretty severe limitations. |
When oil and gas producers tell me the problem is there is not enough oil left to be discovered, and the problem isn't refining capicity, I tend to listen.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:54 Post subject:
Yep, it's true. Things like travel will once again be for the elite only.
I just don't see why we need to be pulled kicking and screaming to the table to start funding sun- and wind-based energy when it's such an obvious need. It's a sad thing to see that people are so driven by money.
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cherylpf
crazy cat lady
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:56 Post subject:
Where is the modern day Cornelius Vanderbilt with his light rails? It would seem to me there is much money to be made in alternative transportation.
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Pug
The Movie Geek
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Posted: 10/28/04 - 10:56 Post subject:
| sonnylax wrote: |
Maybe, maybe not. You can set limitations on their work.
Whether you agree or not, our economy (top to bottom) will take a severe hit once oil dries up. You think we saw horrible inflation and unemployment rates during the Jimmy Carter years... wait till that happens. |
You can set limitations, severe limitations even. But i think what I would worry about if I was the lobby is that 5 years down the road (or more, or less, who knows) those restrictions would start to be whittled away. There won't be a jump from 5% to 100%, but restrictions will get whittled away and gradually we'll find that there is more and more drilling in the Refuge.
I do agree about the hit the economy will take. Ignoring the social aspect of cars and driving, there are so many business that are dependant on oil and oil-based fuels. I can buy a hybrid car or a car that runs on trash (hey, i saw Back to the Future 2, it could work!), but it will likely be a longer, harder change for the Trucking Industry, and that will impact any industry company that relies on trucking for transportation of their goods.
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