The Long Emergency - (or the impending energy crisis)
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megawill
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 Posted: 04/18/05 - 20:11 Post subject:
| AlaninTX wrote: | | I have said it before, and I will say it again. Go read Hubert's "Peak Oil Theory." Google those words. Demand has crossed exploration, we are now living on proven reserves, and if you think things are bad now wait until, oh, say, 2011. |
which would be um, reason 87 that history may judge GWB as the worst president of the modern era....
nero, anyone??? 
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megawill
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Posted: 04/18/05 - 20:47 Post subject:
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TOsteve
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Posted: 04/19/05 - 08:38 Post subject:
| megawill wrote: |
which would be um, reason 87 that history may judge GWB as the worst president of the modern era....
nero, anyone??? |
I know you're not blaming peak oil on GWB but some people reading this might react that way. Some could argue that W is doing the exact opposite of Nero - in that he is proactively seeking to secure as much access to crude oil resources for the US as his military resources will allow.
The Bush II administration will likely be remembered more for its enormous miscalculation in thinking that the US military might could help solve this problem (or at least buy more time for the US corporate interests). Do you think a Democrat president would have offered more hope for a better future? Kerry sure didn't seem to have any real answers.
I will stick to my belief that the real power lies in public opinion. Until the majority of the population can get its head out of the sand no viable solutions exist.
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cherylpf
crazy cat lady
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Posted: 04/19/05 - 13:40 Post subject:
| TOsteve wrote: | | I will stick to my belief that the real power lies in public opinion. Until the majority of the population can get its head out of the sand no viable solutions exist. |
Well, call me a pessimist but that leaves me really doubtful for any solution. I think when it comes to facing major changes, like, as Kunstler said, the public and specifically the current middle class (which definitely includes me) risks losing lots of things, and facing that people would prefer to keep their head in the sand until forced to do something otherwise.
Being more realistic, wouldn't raising gas prices at least force people to look at this? Is the economy the reason we're putting blinders on to the future and only looking short term? Because ultimately won't that bite us economically too? Did anyone in control of this have to take macro and micro economics?
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 04/19/05 - 14:23 Post subject:
I think the same thing about water. The reason people in Europe bathe a lot less is not b/c they love being stinky, it's b/c water is a lot more expensive.
We have it so good it's killing us.
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cherylpf
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Posted: 04/19/05 - 14:26 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | | We have it so good it's killing us. |
well. said.
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TOsteve
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Posted: 04/19/05 - 14:39 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: |
Well, call me a pessimist but that leaves me really doubtful for any solution. I think when it comes to facing major changes, like, as Kunstler said, the public and specifically the current middle class (which definitely includes me) risks losing lots of things, and facing that people would prefer to keep their head in the sand until forced to do something otherwise.
Being more realistic, wouldn't raising gas prices at least force people to look at this? Is the economy the reason we're putting blinders on to the future and only looking short term? Because ultimately won't that bite us economically too? Did anyone in control of this have to take macro and micro economics? |
The fact that corporate interest shares a bed with both the Republicans and Democrats coupled with the fact that most Americans believe that their only reasonable political voice is to decide whether they're Republican or Democrat - makes me even more pessimistic that this is the answer (deep breath after run-on sentence). Please note that, as a Canadian, I'm not attacking America. The exact same problem exists in my country as well, I'm just speaking in terms that most of the readers on this board would recognize.
Give people some credit - revolutions have happened in the past. Its a matter of enough people realizing that what the problem is and learning how to best express their political voice.
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RexRacer
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Posted: 04/27/05 - 12:15 Post subject:
Very interesting post, and a subject that I've been involved with for some time and have occasionally ranted about on these very pages.
A few thoughts:
For good or ill, we may already have a glimpse at what life may look like in the post-oil age just 90 miles off the Florida coast--Cuba.
Faced with massive cuts in support from the defunct Soviet Union and a crippling US embargo, the Cubans turned inward to provide for themselves. And it's not all bad news, per se.
They lead the world in urban and peri-urban agriculture. Forget the manicured lawn, in the future we're more likely to see the return of the WW2-era Victory Garden as a way to reduce our dependence on imported, transported, and purchased fruits and vegetables.
Cuba has also made impressive gains in herbal and alternative medicines, out of the economic necessity that we may soon face as well. Scientists and physicians are flocking there to learn from their advances.
My favorite line of the original post: The US has a rail system that would shame Bulgaria. Just thought I'd share!!
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blue
your favorite weapon
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Joined: 21 May 2002
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Posted: 04/29/05 - 16:51 Post subject:
i'll tell you this much - i could've bombed over to my buddy's house tonight and then walked to the big game, but i've put in like $30 of gas into my car, and barely got 10 trips to school out of it.
i'm getting my arse on the bus and making use of my bus pass.
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tdassow
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Posted: 05/16/05 - 02:53 Post subject:
The article has a lot of good points. It seems that Energy Policy is quite an emotional topic. Right now gasoline costs $2.31/ gallon, skim milk costs $4.29. Oil and gas is still cheap! However, it is finite, it does pollute, and should be conserved. I do believe that the US wastes this resource we should be taking pains to conserve oil and develop alternatives. (One of the best books I read on this topic is Cradle to Cradle by William McDonough.)
I agree with the trend of the article, but I think it will be slower. Perhaps it is wishful thinking. Once gas and oil prices reach certain points it will become economical use and develop alternative sources. Life will change, but barring any international crisis, (like China absorbing the Middle-East,) I think it will be a slower process.
Great read. Thanks for sharing Blue.
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