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DCRunningDiva
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 Posted: 12/14/04 - 13:46 Post subject: Political Correctness
Growing up in somewhat of a backwoods type of neighborhood I have to say that political correctness was not something we took pride in having knowledge of. Since moving to DC political correctness is king! I had some troubles with a friend when I first moved here because I wasn't politically correct with her and it was specifically because I said a phrase that really meant nothing to me (from a historical standpoint) but meant everything to her culture.
Have we gone too far with political correctness? Why does it seem people take offense so easily?
I have found it quite interesting among some of my African American friends because they want to be called "black." They have no ties to Africa and, hence, don't want to be called that. So, if I call one person African American I get "chewed out" and if I call another one "black" I get chewed out. That is just an example, obviously, because I'm not specifically talking about that community of people. I am speaking generally of "political correctness."
What is your take on the whole thing?
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jrjo
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 13:49 Post subject:
I'm confused when the same people that wave the banner "freedom of speech" also insist on political correctnesspeak.
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MechEngDropout
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 13:57 Post subject:
Euphamistic speach in general is excessive in many cases. Like someone else said, it seems like we're becoming a country of whiners. Language becomes less and less descriptive, complete meanings are changed, but hey... as long as we offend or scare the minimum number of people we're doing good, right? Ha.
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robp
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 14:39 Post subject:
I am not PC and don't care if that irritates anyone.
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DCRunningDiva
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 14:53 Post subject:
| robp wrote: | | I am not PC and don't care if that irritates anyone. |
I'm only saying this because I've "been there" but you would never "survive" in the DC area. If you aren't PC then you are standing on the street corner asking for money. It's almost that bad. You can lose your job for not being PC in this town. 
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Pug
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 15:21 Post subject:
I think there are degrees.
Some things you can't say to certain people because it personally offends them. You learn what is offensive and then you don't say it to that person. Other things are generally deemed offensive in society.
You don't call a black person a n---er. Less offensive, but still is Negro. You probably won't call that same person "Colored". Black or African American are generally acceptable, but it depends on who you are speaking to and what that person's preferences are. My wife is not a big fan of African American because she's not from Africa. She's from Richfield. Her mother and grandmother are both from the Minneapolis area. She's as American as I am to not have a disclaimer in front of "American". Perhaps more so since my paternal grandparents were immigrants from England. She doesn't really describe herself as black, but brown. I just say chocolate. 
You'd find a similar thing with homosexuals. F-g and D-yke are not appropriate in polite conversation. Gay and Lesbian are, though perhaps some do not like the term. I get to joke with one of my wife's friends that he "plays for the other team". That's personal and I wouldn't say it to someone I just met on the street.
So even though we don't always see things as being politically correct there are things we do and do not say (and should not). And if someone said that I was vocally impaired because I have a stutter, I'd think seriously about pimp slapping that person.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 15:38 Post subject:
I think racism and hate speech are much more prevalent than the majority knows, and much more hurtful. None of today's commentary has made me see what's wrong with paying attention to other people's concerns.
To answer the free speech/PC "paradox" (as some see it), I think we all understand that most speech is protected, and there are some types of speech that aren't protected, and some that are lesser protected, and that's as it should be. So try not to make the assumption that those who value civil liberty all feel the same way about everything or that they don't feel the same way as you.
Actually, there is a small movement afoot in the world of law academia to take hate speech out of the realm of protected speech, akin to inciting to illicit activity/crossburning.
(Calling someone black instead of African American doesn't fall under hate speech. Hate speech has to intend to injure or intimidate someone based on their race, sex, ethnicity, religion, or sexual identity.)
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robp
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:01 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | I think racism and hate speech are much more prevalent than the majority knows, and much more hurtful. None of today's commentary has made me see what's wrong with paying attention to other people's concerns.
To answer the free speech/PC "paradox" (as some see it), I think we all understand that most speech is protected, and there are some types of speech that aren't protected, and some that are lesser protected, and that's as it should be. So try not to make the assumption that those who value civil liberty all feel the same way about everything or that they don't feel the same way as you.
Actually, there is a small movement afoot in the world of law academia to take hate speech out of the realm of protected speech, akin to inciting to illicit activity/crossburning.
(Calling someone black instead of African American doesn't fall under hate speech. Hate speech has to intend to injure or intimidate someone based on their race, sex, ethnicity, religion, or sexual identity.) |
And then you probably open up an entire new realm of what could be or should be defined as hate speech. It would still be subjected to someone's biased opinion.
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robp
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:03 Post subject:
| DCRunningDiva wrote: |
I'm only saying this because I've "been there" but you would never "survive" in the DC area. If you aren't PC then you are standing on the street corner asking for money. It's almost that bad. You can lose your job for not being PC in this town. |
That's okay, DC isn't on my short list of fun places to live. 
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copteacher
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:03 Post subject:
a lot of speech could be classified as "hate" just like crimes. That is why I do not like "hate crimes" per se. It is so subjective. The law needs to be more black and white than gray. Gray leaves too much lattitude for activist judges on both sides.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:20 Post subject:
| rtpd113 wrote: | | a lot of speech could be classified as "hate" just like crimes. That is why I do not like "hate crimes" per se. It is so subjective. The law needs to be more black and white than gray. Gray leaves too much lattitude for activist judges on both sides. |
I would argue that even though a judge doesn't intend to put forth an agenda, they are still impacted by daily events and trends and their opinions are altered, just like the rest of us. To that end, how can there be a judge who isn't "activist" on some level?
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copteacher
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:22 Post subject:
two things
letter of the law
spirit of the law
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:31 Post subject:
| rtpd113 wrote: | two things
letter of the law
spirit of the law |
What should one derive from this?
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copteacher
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 16:38 Post subject:
some things are interpreted others are clear.
We sometimes at the police level, understand there is a spirit of the law, for example, if someone is speeding to the hospital because of a medical emergency, it is justified, did the person break the law yes, but the spirit of the law is latitude sometimes.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 12/14/04 - 17:20 Post subject:
| rtpd113 wrote: | some things are interpreted others are clear.
We sometimes at the police level, understand there is a spirit of the law, for example, if someone is speeding to the hospital because of a medical emergency, it is justified, did the person break the law yes, but the spirit of the law is latitude sometimes. |
I get it. I'm just saying that even those judges who purport to be against judicial activism are themselves part of it, even unintentionally. Cases turn on not wanting to go back to a particular line of reasoning now that some other factor comes into play, or being in a war, or whatever. It's unavoidable, they should all just cop (ha!) to it instead of acting so sanctimonious, like they're above it.
Edited to say that I've always wondered if cops understood that sometimes there's a justifiable reason for breaking the law. Glad to know some think so.
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