I'm staying out of the "for the Texans on the Forum thr
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kattzoo
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 Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:06 Post subject:
RunTexas...don't worry about any serious debate happening here. It's a rarity. Now disgusting pictures and child like insults...that's another story. (and precisely why I'm here)
If you really have to see a Riff Raff argument...post whether or not the toilet paper should go over or under.
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shelflifers
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:08 Post subject:
| kattzoo wrote: | RunTexas...don't worry about any serious debate happening here. It's a rarity. Now disgusting pictures and child like insults...that's another story. (and precisely why I'm here)
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Up yer nose with a rubber hose, katzoo!!! 
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elkid
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:16 Post subject:
| kattzoo wrote: | | Now disgusting pictures and child like insults... |
F--K YOU - YOU STINK!  And really, this is getting too easy; give me a challenge here, people....
[
"His name is Robert Paulson. His name is Robert Paulson...."
Twice in a single thread! I rock! 
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kattzoo
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:32 Post subject:
shelffie -   (how's that for a smart comeback!)
Elkid - need a challenge? Get some new pics for pete's sake. You're getting predicatable!
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RunTexas
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:41 Post subject:
I'm sure these two agree with you.....
I just don't understand why some vegans have this need to ram this lifestyle choice down the throats of others. So full of contempt and judgment of others. It's just food for Christ's sake. That's why it's here...to eat.
Vegan parents on trial for baby's severe malnutrition
(Court TV) — Silva Swinton and her husband, Joseph, followed a strict vegan diet in their Queens home. They swore off meat and dairy products and existed on a regiment of vegetables, grains, seeds and nuts.
When Silva gave birth to a daughter, Ice, in July 2000, they put the newborn on the same plan. Instead of breast milk or baby formula, Ice Swinton got herbal tea, flax seed oil, fruit juices and a homemade soy drink.
The result, authorities say, was a health catastrophe that rises to the level of a crime. At 15 months, the girl weighed only 10 pounds and had no teeth. She could not sit up or talk and had a swollen abdomen.
Doctors diagnosed her with severe malnutrition and rickets, and the Queens district attorney said it was one of the worst cases of neglect he'd seen.
Her parents are now on trial in Queens Supreme Court on first-degree assault charges that could land them each in jail for 25 years.
The Swintons, both 32, maintain they are loving parents who doted on Ice and thought the diet was best for her and her little brother, Ini, who was born after the couple's arrest. Both children are in foster care. In his opening statement last Tuesday, Silva Swinton's attorney, Christopher Shella, told the jury of nine women and three men, "At the end of the trial, you'll find that the choices they made were not criminal, but human."
The Swintons may take the witness stand in their own defense later this week. According to her lawyer, Silva Swinton suffered from medical problems, including obesity, before becoming a vegan. Both parents were suspicious of doctors and medicine, and Silva Swinton delivered Ice at home. The girl weighed three pounds, according to a bathroom scale, Swinton later told a social worker. The Swintons also refused to have their daughter immunized.
The prosecution's case has focused on the severity of Ice's medical problems and her parents' apparent lack of concern.
The doctor who examined Ice in November 2001, after an anonymous tip about neglect led to the intervention of children's services, testified last Wednesday that the girl, then 15 months old, looked like a newborn. He said her spindly arms and legs were bowed by rickets, her belly was distended and her skin covered in "the worst diaper rash you ever saw."
Ice "looked like someone you'd see coming out of a famine in a far-off country," Dr. Jay Berger of Long Island Jewish Hospital testified.
The EMT who took Ice to the hospital told jurors her hair was matted and filthy and her fingernails were so long and dirty as to resemble "claws."
The girl spent nearly four months in the hospital and in a rehabilitation center. Another physician, an expert in childhood malnutrition, testified Monday that Ice was "at a severe and critical risk of dying" when removed from her home. Dr. Roy Brown also said Ice may be dogged throughout her life by developmental delays caused by a lack of nutrition to the brain during her infancy.
Prosecutor Eric Rosenbaum also called a nutrition expert and practicing vegan who said the couple did not seem to be practicing a mainstream vegan diet. Amy Joy Lanou, of the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine, said that vegans are encouraged to breast feed their children or use a manufactured soy-based formula instead. She also pointed out that the Swintons gave the baby cod liver oil, an animal product vegans avoid.
Throughout the testimony, Silva Swinton, who is free on $20,000 bail, and Joseph, who remains in jail, whispered to each other at the defense table and wrote notes to their attorneys.
Some prosecution witnesses have described the couple as deeply caring but oblivious. A doctor who treated Ice said the couple expressed "paranoid themes" about the hospital's treatment of their daughter, but also seemed loving. The mother, the doctor testified, was taking care of Ice "according to her belief" without realizing the harm done.
A social worker who insisted Ice go to the hospital testified Monday that while she had grave concerns about the girl's health, she was certain the parents were devoted.
"I was really going to try to work with the family. The mother and father obviously do love their child a lot," said social worker Kelly Harris.
Shella and Joseph Swinton's lawyer, Ronna Gordon-Galchus, have suggested both that the Swintons did not realize the danger of the diet and that Ice's problems have more to do with her premature birth than with malnutrition.
Last edited by RunTexas on 07/25/03 - 12:41; edited 1 time in total
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elkid
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:41 Post subject:
| kattzoo wrote: | | Elkid - need a challenge? Get some new pics for pete's sake. You're getting predicatable! |
You really do not know what you are asking for. Do not go there. These pictures here were specifically requested some time ago - I do not do this for fun, but merely to fulfill that responsibility I have.
But manboobs are manboobs. Here's Joel with Chris Farley!
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RunTexas
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:53 Post subject:
| elkid wrote: | | I do not do this for fun, but merely to fulfill that responsibility I have. |
Well it's my responsibilty to eat all the animal flesh I can grill to a perfect medium rare and chase with a perfect 94' Napa cabernet. But I don't have the moronic compulsion to tell everybody about it.
It's still goes back to basic freedoms and liberties. These are the guiding principles our Founding Fathers created this country on. So here it is...Eat anything you want, just don't tell me what food is MORAL to consume.
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genie
Master of Prissface
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 12:54 Post subject:
| RunTexas wrote: | There is always one in every group. 
A person's diet is just that...it's what he/she decides to ingest. It's not a religion. And regardless of what some of the more extreme would say, meat is a good thing for the human body.
Personally I try my hardest not to ingest ANY meat from a grocery store. Everything I consume is straight from mother nature or from a good butcher shop. I have countless relatives who not only lived into thier 90's but a few into thier 100's and consumed all the dairy and meat they could enjoy. Along with the freshest vegetables they could grow.
I hope this doesn't turn into one of those moronic Omni vs. Veggie debates. They are tiresome and go nowhere.
Let's just all get along......  |
I'll to that!!!
I can't imagine being from TX and not eating meat, it's all so tasssssty down there!!!!
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elkid
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 14:07 Post subject:
| RunTexas wrote: | | elkid wrote: | | I do not do this for fun, but merely to fulfill that responsibility I have. |
Well it's my responsibilty to eat all the animal flesh I can grill to a perfect medium rare and chase with a perfect 94' Napa cabernet. But I don't have the moronic compulsion to tell everybody about it.
It's still goes back to basic freedoms and liberties. These are the guiding principles our Founding Fathers created this country on. So here it is...Eat anything you want, just don't tell me what food is MORAL to consume. |
Where did this come from, and how did I get looped into it??? I have no idea how you put my quote (which was about putting up gross pictures) with that idea. I never said anything what you or someone else ate (that must've been someone else's "moronic compulsion"); actually you started it for reasons unknown, since it has nothing to do with this thread. 
So please do not drag me very erroneously into your political arguments - I can do that well enough on my own. And the eating habits of people is not one I care to discuss, debate, or otherwise associate myself with. Again, don't know how you made that connection, but keep me out of it.
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genie
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 14:20 Post subject:
| RunTexas wrote: |
It's still goes back to basic freedoms and liberties. These are the guiding principles our Founding Fathers created this country on. So here it is...Eat anything you want, just don't tell me what food is MORAL to consume. |
I don't think anyone's doing that here, and I thought you said you didn't WANT to get into a political debate? So why is this leaning toward that very angle?
I think it's high time for  ...anyone for extra pepperoni?
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elkid
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 14:35 Post subject:
genie, I see your and up you a  ! or twenty
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shelflifers
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 14:38 Post subject:
Homer: Are you saying you're never going to eat any animal again? What about bacon?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Ham?
Lisa: No!
Homer: Pork chops?
Lisa: Dad, those all come from the same animal!
Homer: Heh heh heh... ooh... yeah... right, Lisa. A wonderful... magical animal.
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airehead
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 14:39 Post subject:
| shelflifers wrote: | Homer: Are you saying you're never going to eat any animal again? What about bacon?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Ham?
Lisa: No!
Homer: Pork chops?
Lisa: Dad, those all come from the same animal!
Homer: Heh heh heh... ooh... yeah... right, Lisa. A wonderful... magical animal. |
Ah, Homer, my hero--said in my best southern accent
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RunTexas
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 15:59 Post subject:
elkid,
I apologize if I came across a bit too venomous. But I take you posting disgusting and vile photographs as an obvious attempt to compare a non-vegan lifestyle to being fat, lazy and diseased. I mean, that was your point...correct? Why else would you take what was innocent banter and inject such repulsive imagery. It's something I have seen all too often with the freaks over at PeTA and ALF. And I have no patience for it.
But again, I apologize for even allowing this to go on as long as it has. I'm bowing out of the topic all together.
After all, this is a running forum, not a group discussion on ethical and moral nutrient consumption.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 07/25/03 - 16:14 Post subject:
Speaking of The Woodlands, have they put natural lawn into that concert venue yet?
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