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camelia bedelia
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Location: God's Country
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 Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:02 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | No, the ethics of it is: what if the girl is better off in terms of living in a nicer house, private school etc. with the kidnapper who by all accounts treated her well, as opposed to her going back to the shoddier neighborhood with more kids and a mom who doesn't speak her language?
Probably no one else in Philly is giving this a second thought. |
Material possession does not guarantee a good upbringing. I don’t think she is better off with a woman who would kidnap and risk people’s lives to set a fire to cover it up even if she is going to attend better school and have nicer shoes.
No matter where she ends up, the kid is going to have an awful lot of emotional baggage to deal with. I can only hope her real mother will refrain from trashing the woman this child knows and loves as “mom”
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jrjo
Gone Fishin
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:05 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | No, the ethics of it is: what if the girl is better off in terms of living in a nicer house, private school etc. with the kidnapper who by all accounts treated her well, as opposed to her going back to the shoddier neighborhood with more kids and a mom who doesn't speak her language?
Probably no one else in Philly is giving this a second thought. |
So if Bill Gates wanted to grab kids off the street, a part of you is considering it might be okay just 'cuz he could give materially anything a kid wanted? 
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Cappy
Excelent
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:05 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | No, the ethics of it is: what if the girl is better off in terms of living in a nicer house, private school etc. with the kidnapper who by all accounts treated her well, as opposed to her going back to the shoddier neighborhood with more kids and a mom who doesn't speak her language?
Probably no one else in Philly is giving this a second thought. |
The law supercedes ethics in any situation.
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purple hayes
Frightened Inmate #2
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:05 Post subject:
I think I'd be willing to give up a little with in trade for the security that I wasn't living with a lying, kidnapping arsonist.
Maybe it's just me though.
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elkid
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:08 Post subject:
| Cappy wrote: | | The law supercedes ethics in any situation. |
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:23 Post subject:
| jrjo wrote: | | Gogirlgo wrote: | No, the ethics of it is: what if the girl is better off in terms of living in a nicer house, private school etc. with the kidnapper who by all accounts treated her well, as opposed to her going back to the shoddier neighborhood with more kids and a mom who doesn't speak her language?
Probably no one else in Philly is giving this a second thought. |
So if Bill Gates wanted to grab kids off the street, a part of you is considering it might be okay just 'cuz he could give materially anything a kid wanted? |
What? I'm not advocating one view or the other, I'm just presenting both. I don't think the material benefits are particularly important. I just think it's interesting that the lowlife could present some positive areas and being with the mother won't necessarily be easy.
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ShannonG
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:27 Post subject:
I think it will be OK. This little girl's biological mother obviously never stopped thinking about her to walk into a party and recognize her. Adjustment will be awful for her, but it sounds as though she's going into a situation where she will be adored.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:34 Post subject:
| elkid wrote: | | Cappy wrote: | | The law supercedes ethics in any situation. |
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Really? 13th, 14th and 15 Amendments tell it differently.
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brie k
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:36 Post subject:
I think ethics can basically be thrown out the window, or into the fire, as it were, since this woman had no better morals than to do what she did. There are some kids out there who probably would fare better being raised by wolves than their current birth parents, but we still don't set fires to their homes to put them in a "better situation."
I see that you're not advocating one way or the other... it is an interesting question.
A good friend told me that kids don't need a lot of stuff, just a mom who loves them. I loved my kids a lot before they were born. By the time they were 10 days old, that love was greater by a thousand % or more... this mother, as long as she loves her child and treats her well, should have her back. Not because it is the law either, but because it is just.
I think the girl can be ok if a lot of people help. Mom needs to talk to counselors herself, make sure she knows what she should and shouldn't say to the child to help her get through this, and also have someone to talk to, to help HER get through this. I imagine it's a huge shock and will continue to be so for all involved.
Whatever happens to the kidnapper, it won't be what she deserves. I cannot imagine thinking that my child had died in a fire, or wondering if that really were the case. That is cruel and unusual punishment. Fortunately for the kidnapper, the Eighth Amendment protects that from happening to her.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:40 Post subject:
[quote="brie k"]
Whatever happens to the kidnapper, it won't be what she deserves. quote]
Absolutely.
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Ms. Jenn
Fresh, Hot & Wild
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:40 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | | What? I'm not advocating one view or the other, I'm just presenting both. I don't think the material benefits are particularly important. I just think it's interesting that the lowlife could present some positive areas and being with the mother won't necessarily be easy. |
If the now 6 yr old girl had never been taken away from her mother in the first place, there wouldn't be any of these issues going on to think about.
I don't know any aspects of the natural mother's life (just the AP article), but her life could have been significantly different if she didn't have to deal with horrible grief caused by the fact that her brand new baby was just killed in a house fire that someone intentionally set.
If the baby had never been taken in the first place, she would have grown up along with her brothers and sisters just like any other person would and there wouldn't have to be any re-acquainting going on.
There is no doubt she belongs with her rightful mother. My opinion would be significantly different if the child had been given up for adoption rather than stolen and her death faked.
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elkid
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:41 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | | elkid wrote: | | Cappy wrote: | | The law supercedes ethics in any situation. |
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Really? 13th, 14th and 15 Amendments tell it differently. |
How? Constitutional amendments ARE law.
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:44 Post subject:
Right, but amendments are done to offset a law that isn't, for a variety of reasons, right. The very fact that we have amendments means that not always does a law supersede ethics.
Mostly, I agree that the law wins and should. But Greg said always, and that's not so. If it were, we'd never have overrulings or amendments.
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Cappy
Excelent
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:44 Post subject:
| Gogirlgo wrote: | | elkid wrote: | | Cappy wrote: | | The law supercedes ethics in any situation. |
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Really? 13th, 14th and 15 Amendments tell it differently. |
The aboltion of slavery
The granting of all persons equal protection and due process .
The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any state on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude
What am I missing here 
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Gogirlgo
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Posted: 03/03/04 - 17:45 Post subject:
Apparently, that the Constitution had to be amended b/c these rights were legally denied in the first place.
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