Cost of education and a generation of indebtedness
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cherylpf
crazy cat lady
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 Posted: 02/01/06 - 11:03 Post subject: Cost of education and a generation of indebtedness
Here's a depressing article for those around my age. This is some of the examples of repercussions of the increasing cost of education and Bush's cutting of federal student financial aid.
Long article but worth it
http://biz.yahoo.com/special/youngearn06_article1.html
I know its all true, I know so many people whose names they could have put in those exact scenarios instead of the names they did use. And here's a scarier train of dominoes that may or may not be real: this (my) generation, whenever it is we do get around to having kids, won't be able to afford to save to the projected college costs for 2022 or whatever, which then puts that generation behind too. Not to mention the fact that we'll all have to work while our kids are growing up (so no home schooling) and we won't have social security to rely on for what we haven't saved for retirement. Where does it stop? I know my generation isn't alone here, current college students are probably racking up the same debts with probably not even as great of job options for when they finish. Will the solution be to stop sending our kids to school? Either no college degree and no debt (and in theory a lower paying job) or college degrees, debt and being behind half your life. It seems a greater divide in classes is approaching. Also a greater divide in the US education level and that of other countries, which means bad news for all of us.
The flip side of the coin too is I know my generation lives "better" than my parents did just out of school. I always hear how the only furniture they had was a card table and all they ate was ground chuck for the first 2 years of marriage. I know we're a marketed-to generation that seems to buy the latest ipod, etc thats flashed our way. And we've been given credit (in the way of cards) by the truckload (which brings another point, when do the credit cards stop giving them out?) So is the solution to just suck it up and take the loans and live like a pauper that many more years past when my parents did to pay it all off?
Thoughts?
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runaroundsue
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Location: supporting GREENer pastures
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 11:56 Post subject:
I always said I don't mind financial aid being cut as long as students CAN borrow. hmmmmmm. I guess I can still stand by that (because I think aid is not distributed correctly--of course, I'm biased) but something HAS to be done about the cost of education and making these loans cheaper.
Yes, every generation has more than the previous. As a parent that is what you want. My DH makes good money now and yet I know some friends question why we don't drive nicer cars, have a nicer house. Because we are working on financing our children's future as well as our retirement. Is it wrong to make college financially easier for our kids???? I don't know. I just don't want them coming home when they have their degrees. I have many neices and nephews and this is what happens. The loan payments kick in and they can't pay them and live on their own. The cost of education has become ridiculous and yet administrators keep giving themselves raises. What until college education starts becoming outsourced!
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jrjo
Gone Fishin
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Joined: 15 May 2002
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Location: Lake Wobegon, MN
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 12:04 Post subject:
Whatever happened to "work your way through college"?
/i did, but of course i'm a zealot freak
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robp
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 12:39 Post subject:
Work your way thru college.... cut out the $50 plus monthly cell phone bill... go to a local school or a community college.... driver a beater vehicle if you even need a car.... there is always a way to achieve a goal.
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camelia bedelia
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 12:41 Post subject:
| jrjo wrote: | Whatever happened to "work your way through college"?
/i did, but of course i'm a zealot freak |
The program I majored in was not offered at a State school, so I had to pay private school tuition and didn't have the option of attending the program part time while I worked full time to support myself. I worked the entire time I was in college too, but I wouldn't have made it if I didn't have financial aid, mega loans and support from my parents.
This isn't just an issue of people not being willing pull them up by the bootstraps and do it themselves, it is about what is good for our country. What is going to make us a better, stronger, more competitive nation in the long run. If we believe education is at least part of the answer, than we should be investing in education at all levels.
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jrjo
Gone Fishin
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 12:52 Post subject:
| camelia bedelia wrote: | | This isn't just an issue of people not being willing pull them up by the bootstraps and do it themselves, it is about what is good for our country. What is going to make us a better, stronger, more competitive nation in the long run. If we believe education is at least part of the answer, than we should be investing in education at all levels. |
Explain what you mean by "investing"?
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cherylpf
crazy cat lady
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 13:04 Post subject:
| jrjo wrote: | Whatever happened to "work your way through college"?
i did, but of course i'm a zealot freak |
In theory this sounds great, but every job I've been able to hold in college I hasn't paid enough to cover, or hasn't allowed time to finish college with any speed. If you don't mind, how much did your school cost, how long did it take and what kind of job and hours/week were you able to do?
I don't mind talking numbers, so I will. I worked 20-25 hours per week at $6ish/hour in college my first time. That was the max I could fit into my schedule. I was fortunate in that I had family support and scholarships, so that helped my living expenses. I graduated with no debt.
Currently, my program at a state school is 21 months. I was told going in it would cost $21,000 before living expenses. They strongly discourage working during school, and our schedule only allows a job late nights and weekends and the rare week day. Ours is also a program, where you have to take the determined classes at the time given, ie, I couldn't take a lesser load to spread out my courses and work more. I personally am working less than even part time for good hourly money but finding the hours is tough. Fortunately I'm fine finanically and am working more for the resume than the bottomline, but those who don't have the privileges I've been given (a basically paid for first degree to allow a job that afforded a second degree) are looking at lots of money to come up with to make not that significant pay when you are talking loan payments.
The cost of education is astronomical, and with more and more reports showing the dumbing down of our nation, I think the inaccessability to good education should be alarming.
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TriBob
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 13:06 Post subject:
I went to a state school to help lower the cost. You get out what you put into it anyway. An internship was my only requirement and they had an intern program. I also worked parttime.
I'm already behind for my kids higher education according to the pundits. I should have been saving $500-600 per month since they were born.  Who the f' has that much money. If they did, they would be worrying about saving money.
I agree it is a big issue and not many take it seriously.
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cherylpf
crazy cat lady
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 13:07 Post subject:
I also think credit card companies should stop offering cards to anyone with a pulse on campus.
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airehead
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 13:15 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: | | I also think credit card companies should stop offering cards to anyone with a pulse on campus. |
It should be illegal to mail offers for cards to kids under a certain age--they should write in and request them instead.
Debt is a huge issue among our young AF airmen.
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megawill
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 13:18 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: | | jrjo wrote: | Whatever happened to "work your way through college"?
i did, but of course i'm a zealot freak |
In theory this sounds great, but every job I've been able to hold in college I hasn't paid enough to cover, or hasn't allowed time to finish college with any speed. If you don't mind, how much did your school cost, how long did it take and what kind of job and hours/week were you able to do?
I don't mind talking numbers, so I will. I worked 20-25 hours per week at $6ish/hour in college my first time. That was the max I could fit into my schedule. I was fortunate in that I had family support and scholarships, so that helped my living expenses. I graduated with no debt.
Currently, my program at a state school is 21 months. I was told going in it would cost $21,000 before living expenses. They strongly discourage working during school, and our schedule only allows a job late nights and weekends and the rare week day. Ours is also a program, where you have to take the determined classes at the time given, ie, I couldn't take a lesser load to spread out my courses and work more. I personally am working less than even part time for good hourly money but finding the hours is tough. Fortunately I'm fine finanically and am working more for the resume than the bottomline, but those who don't have the privileges I've been given (a basically paid for first degree to allow a job that afforded a second degree) are looking at lots of money to come up with to make not that significant pay when you are talking loan payments.
The cost of education is astronomical, and with more and more reports showing the dumbing down of our nation, I think the inaccessability to good education should be alarming. |
i worked 40 hours a week and took 9-12 credit hours a semester for several semesters to finish my BA...however, i went to a commuter school with an excellent night program...i was a resident of the state of tejas at the time and state tuition was dirt cheap...
however, i choose my degree based off of what i could complete working my schedule...i chose against pre-pharmacy because of the situation cheryl describes...i chose against computer science because i couldn't figure out how i'd fit all the lab time in...so i settled for a degree...the piece of paper (diploma) has treated me well -- i'm well ahead were i would have dreamed both position and salary wise -- so no real regrets, but i haven't worked one day in the field (accounting) that i obtained my degree in..
---
megawill
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jrjo
Gone Fishin
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 13:30 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: | | jrjo wrote: | Whatever happened to "work your way through college"?
i did, but of course i'm a zealot freak |
In theory this sounds great, but every job I've been able to hold in college I hasn't paid enough to cover, or hasn't allowed time to finish college with any speed. If you don't mind, how much did your school cost, how long did it take and what kind of job and hours/week were you able to do?
I don't mind talking numbers, so I will. I worked 20-25 hours per week at $6ish/hour in college my first time. That was the max I could fit into my schedule. I was fortunate in that I had family support and scholarships, so that helped my living expenses. I graduated with no debt. |
I went to a state U and can't quite remember the cost, but I think it always stayed under $1000 per quarter back in the late '80s. My job was in an office at $7ish/hr and I worked 30-40 hr weeks. I did a four year accounting degree in four years.. plus a couple of those years running 50-70/mi weeks and courting mrs.jrjo all along. So, no it wasn't a cakewalk but you can see why I've got little sympathy for people racking up $50,000 in debt. 
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MechEngDropout
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 14:20 Post subject:
| robp wrote: | | Work your way thru college.... cut out the $50 plus monthly cell phone bill... go to a local school or a community college.... driver a beater vehicle if you even need a car.... there is always a way to achieve a goal. |
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thegman
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 16:04 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: |
In theory this sounds great, but every job I've been able to hold in college I hasn't paid enough to cover, or hasn't allowed time to finish college with any speed. If you don't mind, how much did your school cost, how long did it take and what kind of job and hours/week were you able to do?
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I went to a private university in the 80's to the tune of around $17K a year. I had a combination of scholarships, grants, and loans. As part of my scholarship, I had a paid work-study job provided by the university, and worked 10-12 hours a week. I used my work-study money to buy books instead of beer, unlike most of my friends. I finished in 4 years.
I worked my tail off and got a free ride to law school. I deferred my admission a year so I could live at home and work to save money for living expenses while I would be in law school. I got married in law school and my wife worked to support us. I clerked during my 2nd and 3rd year, and we actually started to make student loan payments while I was still in school, even though we could defer payment until after I finished school.
I had no law school related debt the day I finished. Although we reduced our undergraduate student loan debt somewhat, I was in practice for 3 years before all of my student loans were paid, however.
My wife and I made sacrifices during the early years of our marriage to get rid of our student loan debt. (She had some school loans as well.) We didn't travel. We didn't go out to eat. If we had a few extra dollars at the end of the month, it went to pay off the loans instead of something else.
I decided at 18 to bite the bullet and knew I would have to take on a lot of debt for school. There was no way to avoid it, and working while in school wouldn't do much to reduce the cost of my degree. All I had was a plan and desire to get out of debt as quickly as possible, though.
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sonnylax
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Posted: 02/01/06 - 16:39 Post subject:
| cherylpf wrote: | | I also think credit card companies should stop offering cards to anyone with a pulse on campus. |
I think its futile to expect the govt. to legislate stupidity.
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