Closing races due to heat
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MechEngDropout
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 Posted: 05/29/06 - 12:53 Post subject: Closing races due to heat
See Pug's Med City Marathon Report in Training Tales for the source of this spin-off thread.
My opinion - which I'm sure many will disagree with - is that the race should not have been called. To me, it is a straight up case of individual responsibility. We all sign the waivers saying we understand the risks and realize that it is a hazardous activity, that weather conditions may be difficult, etc. After I sign that waiver, I accept full responsibility. If I can't go on because I have a sprained ankle, I have to pull myself from the race - not anyone else. It's the same thing with the heat. I have to pull myself, not have the race closed in front of me. I know it is a case of some people spoiling it for others - those people that don't realize how much they are getting drained and then plopping out. Harsh viewpoint maybe, but I think mostly it is their fault. If I train, plan a weekend, spend money on registration, travel, and hotel, the race had better not close for heat. It's a summer race, you know it's a possibility that it may be hot. Look at Boston. In 2004 they had 95 degree temps and almost certainly a lot of DNFs, but they didn't close the course.
My point, summarily, is that it's the runners responisbility.
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jenn7
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 13:10 Post subject:
I totally agree with you - it should have been an individual decision to stop.
What I read said that they let people finish if they wanted, just stopped taking times at 5:15 - what's the point of stopping the race due to heat if you aren't going to pull people off the course?
From here: http://www.wkowtv.com/index.php/news/story/p/pkid/24094
"While runners were allowed to finish, organizers stopped keeping time five hours and 15 minutes into the race."
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MechEngDropout
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 13:16 Post subject:
| jenn7 wrote: | I totally agree with you - it should have been an individual decision to stop.
What I read said that they let people finish if they wanted, just stopped taking times at 5:15 - what's the point of stopping the race due to heat if you aren't going to pull people off the course?
From here: http://www.wkowtv.com/index.php/news/story/p/pkid/24094
"While runners were allowed to finish, organizers stopped keeping time five hours and 15 minutes into the race." |
Realistically, how well are you allowing them to finish when you pull all of the aide? I don't think any marathoner will go the last 6 miles without water in any conditions, much less 95 degree heat.
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Pug
The Movie Geek
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 13:23 Post subject:
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MechEngDropout
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 13:26 Post subject:
I wonder when the other RRs will report about Mad City. Didn't we have a few doing that also? Bad week for Riff Raff Marathoning...
I think JU did the half...
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Pug
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 13:32 Post subject:
| MechEngDropout wrote: | | I wonder when the other RRs will report about Mad City. Didn't we have a few doing that also? Bad week for Riff Raff Marathoning... |
Indeed. I was looking for that this morning.
I've been thinking about this thread so far and I still think the RD made the best decision. I didn't mention in the report, but when I got to mile 11 the water stop was nearly out of water. Granted there weren't many folks behind me, but if the water stops are in danger of running out of water and this is only a small marathon of a few hundred people, the organizational skill and support just isn't there compared to a Boston. Boston is probably better equipped to handle greater emergencies than Rochester, Minnesota. 100+ years of experience plus it is a major marathon. Much of this race was on isolated bike trails. Scenic, but isolated.
It's a tough choice and I know something like Badwater wouldn't cancel (because really, can it get hotter?) but given the nature of Med City and probably Mad City, I understand.
At some point of Boston I imagine there is water at every mile after 16...Med City was every other mile after 3 and it was mostly warm.
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gretriever
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 15:28 Post subject:
| MechEngDropout wrote: | I wonder when the other RRs will report about Mad City. Didn't we have a few doing that also? Bad week for Riff Raff Marathoning...
I think JU did the half... |
The link Jenn7 posted is from a Madison TV station - W-K-O-W - hey, they're clever!
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JACKED UP
PRESIDENT
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 15:30 Post subject:
I agree with MED here. They did the same thing in Madison yesterday. I think closing due to heat was a bad call. I take responsibility for myself by signing the wavier. I felt more at risk 2 years ago in Madison when it was like 40 degrees, pouring down rain, thunder, lightning n hail. In fact I stepped in a pot hole that was covered by a small lake in the middle of the street and sprained my ankle at mile 8 of the half but I finished by my choice.They didn't call the race then.  Most of us train in theses extreme conditions at some time or other also. I feel bad for the people who put in the training and then not being given the choice to continue or not. Recommend that they stop, sure. But don't take away from everyone because some have failed to be properly trained or whatever.
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karlene
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 16:38 Post subject:
I agree with you also MED
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rolling rock
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 16:51 Post subject:
calling the race because of heat is extreme, but it seems like someone in the organizing "booth" had this vision of people dropping like flies, a runner maybe even dying, and then hearing the words "the race should have been called you thoughtless twits" i suppose they thought dealing with the disappointment of the DNFs would be easier than hearing "if you'd have cancelled this race, she'd still be alive"...just erring on the far side of caution i guess.
i don't agree with their calling it but they were damned no matter what on this one.
is this a new marathon?
what a terrible weather weekend to run for everyone. yikes.
heat sucks!
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gretriever
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 17:19 Post subject:
| rolling rock wrote: | calling the race because of heat is extreme, but it seems like someone in the organizing "booth" had this vision of people dropping like flies, a runner maybe even dying, and then hearing the words "the race should have been called you thoughtless twits" i suppose they thought dealing with the disappointment of the DNFs would be easier than hearing "if you'd have cancelled this race, she'd still be alive"...just erring on the far side of caution i guess.
i don't agree with their calling it but they were damned no matter what on this one.
is this a new marathon?
what a terrible weather weekend to run for everyone. yikes.
heat sucks! |
Thank you, RR. While I'm generally agreeing with the lines of "I signed the app and waiver, so it's my responsibility", your post made me think of it from a different point. Namely, what about the support staff and volunteers? If you say "we aren't shutting the race down, regardless" where does this put the staff? And especially the volunteers - are they under a legal obligation to stay? (I think the fact they're volunteers is the answer there)
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karlene
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 17:24 Post subject:
| gretriever wrote: | | rolling rock wrote: | calling the race because of heat is extreme, but it seems like someone in the organizing "booth" had this vision of people dropping like flies, a runner maybe even dying, and then hearing the words "the race should have been called you thoughtless twits" i suppose they thought dealing with the disappointment of the DNFs would be easier than hearing "if you'd have cancelled this race, she'd still be alive"...just erring on the far side of caution i guess.
i don't agree with their calling it but they were damned no matter what on this one.
is this a new marathon?
what a terrible weather weekend to run for everyone. yikes.
heat sucks! |
Thank you, RR. While I'm generally agreeing with the lines of "I signed the app and waiver, so it's my responsibility", your post made me think of it from a different point. Namely, what about the support staff and volunteers? If you say "we aren't shutting the race down, regardless" where does this put the staff? And especially the volunteers - are they under a legal obligation to stay? (I think the fact they're volunteers is the answer there) |
two very good points.
I know i wouldn't want to be the one making that decision..
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JACKED UP
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 17:54 Post subject:
| gretriever wrote: | | rolling rock wrote: | calling the race because of heat is extreme, but it seems like someone in the organizing "booth" had this vision of people dropping like flies, a runner maybe even dying, and then hearing the words "the race should have been called you thoughtless twits" i suppose they thought dealing with the disappointment of the DNFs would be easier than hearing "if you'd have cancelled this race, she'd still be alive"...just erring on the far side of caution i guess.
i don't agree with their calling it but they were damned no matter what on this one.
is this a new marathon?
what a terrible weather weekend to run for everyone. yikes.
heat sucks! |
Thank you, RR. While I'm generally agreeing with the lines of "I signed the app and waiver, so it's my responsibility", your post made me think of it from a different point. Namely, what about the support staff and volunteers? If you say "we aren't shutting the race down, regardless" where does this put the staff? And especially the volunteers - are they under a legal obligation to stay? (I think the fact they're volunteers is the answer there) |
And I agree with this too. However, I for one am not gonna volunteer for anything not knowing exactly what is or could be expected of me. Provide hats, umbrellas, water to volunteers also. Or even work in hour or two shifts. It is a tough call and somebody loses either way.
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Pug
The Movie Geek
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 18:56 Post subject:
| rolling rock wrote: |
is this a new marathon?
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Med City is in the eleventh year running and someone from the Mayo Clinic was involved in the decision to call the race. Mad City has been at it for a little more than ten years, I think.
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SLOjim
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Posted: 05/29/06 - 19:43 Post subject:
Once they have started the race I feel they have an obligation to the runners. Back in the early 90's I ran Long Beach Marathon with the temps at the start of the race at 85 and went up to over 105. There was a stern warning of the days temps before the race and many runners decided not to run... I was a fool and decided to run and learned a good lesson about dehydration. They didn't shut the course down but they did provide extra support and ambulances and made sure there was adequate medical staff at the finish line with dozens of cots and IVs ready for the runners. It was a race I'll never forget.... my goal 3:45 turned into a 5:30 death march.
Bottom line is that it's the race director's call..... there could be insurance and liability issues.
Jim
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