The time now is 12/05/08 - 02:47
Log in: Username: Password:
Search forums for:
  
Calculator Running Log Uploads Smilies Calendar
FAQ Search    Articles Register Log in

Big Brother or Homeland Security???


www.runningforums.com Forum Index -> Riff-Raff Hang Out

Post new topic   Reply to topic
Crazy Joe Divola
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 13 Nov 2002
Posts: 133
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 14:08    Post subject: Big Brother or Homeland Security???
The Homeland Security Act was being debated as late as Monday in the US Senate after breezing through the US House by a vote of 299-121.

It’s unclear whether this new department will give the United States any more advantage in fighting terrorism on the domestic front. About the only definitive positive item to emerge from this bill as of now is that the federal workers in the department will not be unionized, keeping the workers from an organized work stoppage and allowing the current President and future Presidents discretion to move workers within the department and hire and fire workers at their discretion.

Last week an item in the bill came to light that is more frightening than a unionized federal work force in charge of our homeland security. According to William Safire of the New York Times there is language tucked into the bill that would allow the federal government to track nearly every move you make.

Huh?

According to Safire, “Every purchase you make with a credit card, every magazine subscription you buy and medical prescription you fill, every Web site you visit and e-mail you send or receive, every academic grade you receive, every bank deposit you make, every trip you book and every event you attend — all these transactions and communications will go into what the Defense Department describes as a virtual, centralized grand database.”

Add these to the list also: Your credit records, your employment history and any marriage or divorce records you have. Your gun registrations, your credit history and credit card accounts will be cross-referenced and matched with your social security number and drivers license information.

Taking a trip on an airline? The government will know. Renting a movie at the video store or on pay per view? They will know. Checking out a book from you public library? They’ll be watching there also. A new government super computer will monitor anything that you do that can be monitored by a private or public computer.

Total Information dossiers on 300 million Americans.


Who is up to this? The FBI? Attorney General John Ashcroft? No.

It will be a Pentagon project. It’s called the “Total Information Awareness” program and would be run by the Defense Department. It would be authorized to collect every type of available public and private data in this “centralized grand database.” The plan is to have computers and analysts use all this available information to determine patterns of behavior in order to detect and identify terrorists and then thwart those plans.

That’s a great idea to use against foreigners but not at the cost of an individual American’s privacy.


The authors of the Homeland Security Act were quick to defend their bill. They came out with a statement over the weekend stating: “The bill contains adequate provisions to protect privacy rights.”

It is said to have a statutorily created privacy officer whose job would be to act as a watchdog over issues such as the snooping cross-referencing computer.

That’s a pretty tough sell considering the technology available. The New York Times technology writer John Markoff described it in detail in an article earlier this month.

“The Pentagon is constructing a computer system that could create a vast electronic dragnet, searching for personal information as part of the hunt for terrorists around the globe — including the United States.”

How can one officer keep an eye on all of this?


It’s unlikely that the ‘privacy officer’ could monitor this without his own super-computer system. Unless the privacy officer has that kind of technology at his disposal he would be overmatched. That means if the information from Safire is accurate, and it seems to be, this plan is an outrage. Americans cannot trade their individual liberties for the illusion of safety. Benjamin Franklin said it well in 1759: “They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”

Franklins quote would likely go into his ‘file’ under Total Information Awareness. This writing would likely go into my ‘file’ and when you read this column online it will go into your newly created ‘file’. What an outrage!

The Pentagon should not be in the business of spying on innocent American citizens electronically.

No matter how difficult America’s situation in battling terrorism and enemies within our borders seems individual American liberties must never be compromised. No matter what incredible technology is available it must never be used against law abiding American citizens.

No illusion of security is ever worth a right held so sacred.
prohemp
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 14 May 2002
Posts: 7716
Location: in the cradle of liberty
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 14:18    Post subject:
Quote:
That means if the information from Safire is accurate, this plan is an outrage. Americans cannot trade their individual liberties for the illusion of safety. Benjamin Franklin said it well in 1759: “They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”


i agree
Laurie Ellen
Queenie
Reply with quote
Joined: 14 May 2002
Posts: 11286
Location: The Dark Side of the Moon
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 14:21    Post subject:
prohemp wrote:
Quote:
That means if the information from Safire is accurate, this plan is an outrage. Americans cannot trade their individual liberties for the illusion of safety. Benjamin Franklin said it well in 1759: “They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”


i agree


1

Who here likes pizza?
runswithscissors
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 8797
Location: In a badger state of mind
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 14:28    Post subject:
Plus, as an American Taxpayer, I'd have to help fund this project. I know what I am doing at every moment, and it doesn't cost me a cent! Wink

I must agree, though. When is this going to end? Looks like Orwell was right, just a few years early.
kristin31
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 8045
Location: Caught in the crossfire of childhood and stardom
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 14:30    Post subject:
PFS (Prety F'ing scary!)
purple hayes
Frightened Inmate #2
Reply with quote
Joined: 14 May 2002
Posts: 14462
Location: ON YOUR LEFT!
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 14:46    Post subject:
Will they be counting my calories too? I'd like to have access to that.
Lord Vader
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2002
Posts: 152
Location: The Rocky Mountain State
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 16:05    Post subject:
I wonder if they'll know how many times that I personally flush my toilet...and if the reason was for a #1 or a #2. Stalker

On a good note Razz , this should pave the way to get rid of all those popup advertisements you get from some websites. Since every window that pops up on your screen will be tracked by the U.S. Government and more likely used against you, it seems fitting that these involuntary popups should cease to exist in order to give us law-abiding citizens a fair chance.
copteacher
Adjunct
Reply with quote
Joined: 08 Jun 2002
Posts: 20588
Location: Teaching in the Halls of Justice
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 17:21    Post subject:
just for the record we do not snoop around people we shouldnt there are to many people that know when we snoop
if you are a good decent citizen nothing to fear

heck your credit card companies know a lot also
so does your bank, your grocery store, your video store


if it helps us get a bad guy then good

i have nothing to hide and nothing to fear

bad guys beware
Sahara
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 17 May 2002
Posts: 3345
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 17:25    Post subject:
rtpd113 wrote:
heck your credit card companies know a lot also
so does your bank, your grocery store, your video store



DANG... those stinking "Advantage Cards" that the local grocery monolith has even knows my time of the month! The cashier spits out coupons to me around the appropriate time.

Needless to say I don't shop for those items there anymore, still get the coupons though.
flarunner
Member
Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2002
Posts: 2230
Location: FLA
| Back to top
PostPosted: 11/21/02 - 18:15    Post subject:
runswithscissors wrote:
I must agree, though. When is this going to end? Looks like Orwell was right, just a few years early.


Uh, late. Like about 18 years.
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic All times are GMT - 4 Hours

www.runningforums.com Forum Index -> Riff-Raff Hang Out

Page 1 of 1

Related topics:
Am I my brother's creeper?
Am i my brother's keeper?
Talked to my brother last night
brother is lost in the wilds of the Rockies
Article on mine and Greg's brother in law
The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes' Smarter Younger Brother
my brothers SUCK!
3 brothers
My Embarrasing Brother.
My brother and his wife
My brother called
Band of Brothers
Brotherly Love (pics)
Movie Review: Two Brothers (2004)
My older brother is going to prison.
older brothers...
GREAT! Now it is my brother!
Brothers Found Guilty of Terrorism Support
oh brother....
My brother is FREE...
In Katrina I Didn’t See Racism, I Saw Brotherhood
My brother-in-law died today
My brothers Cat
my brother might be moving out...
My brothers cat...
Book Review: Beyond Band of Brothers, Dick Winters, MAJ USA
Franks Brother
band of brothers
Biking Brotherhood and Sisterhood
Little sisters get better treatment than older brothers
It's like I found my long-lost brother
Relax everyone !! Homeland Security is working
Internet Security
Fixing Social Security
security concern at our high school
Li'l Heads-Up on Bike Security
Panda Security - Free Antivirus software for a year
Hey you security guard with the strobe light directing
New Airport Security Measure
Social Security Update
Social Security Benefits
I guess that's one way to supplement your Social Security...
Security Camera Presents!!!
So on my first day as acting director of security...
truamatized by mall security...
How to Install a Texas Wireless Security System
Social Security Question